Hello,

In answering a post in a different area, I asked a question I'd like to put up here:

How much does the Vatican influence the daily life of Italians?

I have heard that the average Italian doesn't go to church much, and an Italian friend told me that the membership of Italian Catholic churches is going down dramatically.

However, I also assume that when laws are made, they reflect Catholic teachings... which seems to run counter to the daily life of Italians....

Thought on this?

Teresa

Teresa - that was a good question.
A few years ago I met two Catholic priests who where coming back to the US from Rome. They were pretty depressed saying that the Vatican sometimes does ignore the facts: according to them (and to me) the Vatican comes up with all these moral rules on how to behave that are quite strict. The Vatican gives very strict guidance regarding conduct and in Italy they all agree with the rules but very few actually follow them entirely. The US priests were complaining that “they cannot give these rules to Americans like they do to Italians!” Italians all agree with the Vatican’s rules, but then they do what they want, while the Americans actually follow them! – In my opinion, rules that do not allow condoms even in countries like India where in certain classes the poverty is extreme and the number of children per family is quite high should not be pushed to follow these extreme rules. Just look at the Catholics in the US – some of them have so many children already! In Italy they claim they are all Catholic – they agree with the Pope/Vatican, but then the birth rate is one of the lowest in the world, with a sad 1.3 child per couple.

Paolo

Ciao Paolo,

I have heard that, too, that the laws from the Vatican are written and expressed "as though being given to a perfect world" but that even the Vatican itself knows that they won't be followed to the letter because they are ridiculously strict.

I also have to agree with you that many Catholics I've met here in the States DO go to extremes to try to follow the rules - often to their own detriment.

And it goes without saying that I agree with you about the condoms, most especially in countries where the birthrate is extremely high and even more vitally, in countries where the threat of spreading HIG/AIDS is high. It is beyond my comprehension that 'Christians' could tell people NOT to use condoms when a family -- or an entire country - doesn't have enough food to feed its already-too-high population... and when it is a proven fact that condoms help prevent the spread of that deadly disease.

Teresa

I feel if everyone had to follow these rules or was forced too, they'd have nothing in life left to enjoy. Take the Italians --god gave them a slyness that keeps them sane in my opinion. The Americans do not have to be so gullible and so ready to always follow instructions. The Vatican has been in charge of so many lives for so many centuries and its a shame. If only everyone could see the size of the piggy bank in Castel Sant'angelo they would understand the Vaticans successful ploy. It works. If Catholicism is not a cult....I dont understand its definition well enough. Thank God-- we have a choice not to follow if we so choose not to. Excuse me if I have offended anyone.

Jacqueline,

I agree with you completely. I think most organized religions end up being no more than a means for the few people in charge to get very wealthy and/or have lots of power, and for the masses to be put in a position of subservience.

I think most religions didn't start that way, however. I like to give them all the benefit of the doubt, and I want to believe that they were all, at one time, truly based on real values - generally "do unto others as you would have them do unto you" or "karma" or some version of that rule which seems to be universal - and then got hijacked along the way.

In essence, yes, thank whatever god is or isn't out there that we do all have a choice in what to believe.

I commend those Catholic priets, especially, who are going against Vatican teachings enough to give condoms to their congregations or in other ways deal in real ways with the real, and no ideal, world.

Teresa

The Vatican does certainly influence the thinking of everyday life in Italy, including the media. Case in point here is the encouraging of the use of condoms in the media. In northern Europe sex is talked about open and freely, yet here so many taboos still surround it and we can of course attribute that to the Vatican's influence. In norhtern Europe it is quite common to see advertisements for safe sex and condoms, yet here I see nothing. I hope it changes. Will it ever? Holding one's head underground (the ostrich ) and not talking about the issue helps no one, especially the young population. Although teaching the public to abstain from sex is not entirely a bad idea, however it is not very realistic, is it? As humans are social animals and nature will call.... I think talking openly is the best way to handle these issues and educating more through the media and in schools.

kfscala

I'm quite keen on Catholicism but my boyfriend asked why I like it when I don't agree with any of the rules! My parents were rather anti-Catholic because of all of these rules but my mother also complains that Catholics who don't follow them are hypocrites! They can't win.

I had a good American Catholic friend who didn't follow some of the rules. He said that the Catholic church was like the government (one that you like!) You may not agree with it, but you support it! I thought that that was a good argument.

Lisa
www.webwritereditor.com
www.bookaddiction.blogspot.com

Ciao Lisa,

Why would you support the Catholic church - or any organization - if you don't agree with it? That seems to run counter to reason.

If you're equating the Catholic church with a government, meaning the laws and rules apply to you if you live under its shadow regardless of what you think of it, then I can understand what you mean... but the Catholic church ISN'T in fact a government. You can choose at any moment to walk out the door and not follow the rules... and unlike a government, Catholicism won't throw you in jail. In fact, I would say that your responsibility to yourself, to be true to what you DO believe, is more important than supporting an organization you don't agree with.

I suppose it could be argued that if you don't follow the rules you go to hell... :eek: ...but that only works if you buy into the whole concept in the first place.

Anyhow, an interesting subject!

Teresa